1. avatar Pavel
    I have to say I am really impressed (once again) by the nigh on immaculate video for Sugar by Fighting With Wire.

    Clearly made by professionals, with care, and consideration for style and fluidity - it is, cheeky as it may sound - what a music video should look like coming from a local act.

    Every band interested in making a video, and of course all film makers that are involved in music video production in this country should take note of it. Budget is not a factor for quality, and whilst I'm sure a penny or two was spent on it, it was well done so.

    You don't need to make quite such a visually high concept video as Sugar, but the effort put into 'proper' cinematography (not just wiggling a camera around in front of a band playing live), editing, colouring and direction will pay off with an end product that has just the same impact.

    EDIT: This isn't at/for anyone in particlar - I just fucking love the fact that Fighting With Wire take their videos seriously.

    In all honesty the videos for 'Sugar' and 'Everyone Needs A Nemesis' are miles above any other that I've seen locally, and in my opinion that gap should not be so large - the talent is there, and the music deserves it.
  2. avatar The Ronster
    <a href="http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=51276400">Sugar</a><br/><object width="600px" height="508px" ><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"/><param name="movie" value="http://mediaservices.myspace.com/services/media/embed.aspx/m=51276400,t=1,mt=video"/><embed src="http://mediaservices.myspace.com/services/media/embed.aspx/m=51276400,t=1,mt=video" width="425" height="360" allowFullScreen="true" type="application/x-shockwave-flash"></embed></object>

    Just for the lazy ones who can't be arsed looking for anything.
  3. avatar The_Martyr
    This has just reminded me how much I like fighting with wire...

    The vid is a little cheesey I think, but it is aesthetically pleasing indeed, even if it does remind me of that damned Sin City malarky...
  4. avatar Pavel
    [quote:ad3cdb5530="The_Martyr"]This has just reminded me how much I like fighting with wire...

    The vid is a little cheesey I think, but it is aesthetically pleasing indeed, even if it does remind me of that damned Sin City malarky...[/quote:ad3cdb5530]

    Filled with a little cheese perhaps, but if I saw that without knowing who Fighting With Wire are I would think they were worth a proper listen.

    Seriously, in the video department we are failing the quality of the music in this country, it deserves better.
  5. avatar nichart
    think this video is ok... but not worth the money that obviously went into it. would be better if they had forgot about the girl/boy thing and the cheesy Sin City backdrop. when you compare it to the ones Chewie Films (Belfast) did for them years ago, with zero budget, it's not worth the extra money.
    I Think the local video scene is ok. check out Brian Phillip Davis (Two Door Cinema Club, oppenhiemer), Chewie Films (FWW, Cat Malojian) and Will McConnell (Dutch Schultz)... all done with hardly any money!
    loads more here
    http://www.nichart.com/musicvids.html
  6. avatar ciara606
    [quote:2b76ff89e6="Pavel"]Seriously, in the video department we are failing the quality of the music in this country, it deserves better.[/quote:2b76ff89e6]

    yea but FWW are on a major record label so of course their gona have better videos than the other un-signed bands
  7. avatar Pavel
    [quote:1b2c820bdb="ciara606"][quote:1b2c820bdb="Pavel"]Seriously, in the video department we are failing the quality of the music in this country, it deserves better.[/quote:1b2c820bdb]

    yea but FWW are on a major record label so of course their gona have better videos than the other un-signed bands[/quote:1b2c820bdb]

    Not neccessarily - there is nothing in that Sugar video that is unattainable, the fact that it is well put together is another matter entirely; that's just showing everyone else up.

    Budget is only as big a limit as you make it. If you have a camera, and can edit, you are defined only by your effort. Everything else after that is a luxury, such as use of green screen, proper lighting, props, sets etc...

    At the end of the day, some of the best films ever made have been shot for pittance in comparison to the bloated budget blockbusters.

    EDIT: ...oh, and clever plug Tristan :D.
  8. avatar hardstaff0p
    [quote:b88dcb36e5]
    Budget is only as big a limit as you make it.[/quote:b88dcb36e5]

    It's as as big as the amount of money you have.
  9. avatar nichart
    think it also makes a difference that the FWW video will definitely be on MTV2 viewed by millions but the only place you can see local videos is youtube or NvTv - belfast community tv (another plug Matt!). means some bands can't be bothered.
    our local video makers are doing work in their free time usually for nothing and the video might get a few hundred hits on youtube.
    Think the brian phillip davis oppeheimer one with photos is an example of how a good director can over come a low budget.

    also i don't know if anyone has got any funding through NIMIC or NIScreen for a music video... anyone know if there's any support out there?
  10. avatar Pavel
    [quote:5c9288fa50="nichart"]think it also makes a difference that the FWW video will definitely be on MTV2 viewed by millions but the only place you can see local videos is youtube or NvTv - belfast community tv (another plug Matt!). means some bands can't be bothered.[/quote:5c9288fa50]

    Well, if we all bust our ass off to make something so good it's erotic then MTV25b12 will come knocking.

    Aim for youtube, and you'll never hit any higher - aim higher, and you might hit youtube.

    [quote:5c9288fa50]also i don't know if anyone has got any funding through NIMIC or NIScreen for a music video... anyone know if there's any support out there?[/quote:5c9288fa50]

    Personally I've found NIScreen to be a no go area for music related work, maybe someone else has had better luck?

    Their £2,500 short film grants would go well towards investment in music projects.

    EDIT: Get them plugs in there ye' boy ya! :wink:
  11. avatar swaneeriver
    [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL3gIO624X8[/url]

    probably one of the best videos ive sen from an NI band.
    obviously alot of money went into it, though id say these guys can well afford it judging by their album and gig sale numbers.

    what a band[/url]
  12. avatar mrginger
    the evening angels gather here is my fave local music video.

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=oHWZHs_eBTo
  13. avatar T Entertainment
    You have to weigh up how much of your time, effort and money it is worth devoting to videos as an unsigned act. It is virtually impossible to get any sort of meaningful airtime without the clout of a label behind you. It is almost equally difficult to get anyone in a record label to devote a nanosecond to watching your self produced video.
    Of course getting a decent video is satisfying of itself, like.
  14. avatar DuncanDisorderly
    I find those not involved in the film making process greatly underestimate how difficult it is to produce a decent music video ESPECIALLY for little to no money. I do everything myself - shooting, lighting, editing, storyboarding etc. Add to that the costs involved - I must have spend nearly two grand on equipment in the past year. Its not a case of pointing a camera at something - it is a difficult, frustrating, tiring but thankfully rewarding process.

    Anyone who gets out there and helps local bands in the process are ok in my book.
  15. avatar Pavel
    [quote:09697001c8="DuncanDisorderly"]I find those not involved in the film making process greatly underestimate how difficult it is to produce a decent music video ESPECIALLY for little to no money. I do everything myself - shooting, lighting, editing, storyboarding etc. Add to that the costs involved - I must have spend nearly two grand on equipment in the past year. Its not a case of pointing a camera at something - it is a difficult, frustrating, tiring but thankfully rewarding process.

    Anyone who gets out there and helps local bands in the process are ok in my book.[/quote:09697001c8]

    No one is saying they aren't - what I am saying is that we all need to try harder.

    Certainly, it takes quite a bit of effort to create something even remotely watchable - and most people are oblivious to this.

    A wild notion you know, but perhaps if we all pooled our resources and talents together we could come up with a good foundation for the creation of consistant broadcast worthy work.

    ...then again, like quite a lot of industry areas in this country, we're all just sitting in 'pockets of air' on our lonesome. I'm sure if even five of us came together as a group rather than as individual film makers it would be creatively beneficial.

    Perhaps we should take note of how the musicians in this country help each other out...no?
  16. avatar DuncanDisorderly
    I, for one, agree wholeheartedly - I said as much during our recent emails. maybe some sort of creative collective would reap results - id be happy to help others making videos if they reciprocated in kind. its something that could definitely be improved on. if anyone needs any help with filming etc pm me.

    sorry for any errors - getting used to my google g1.
  17. avatar Cake
    The video wasn't as expensive to make as you might think...
  18. avatar The_Martyr
    Is that man in 'Everyone Needs a Nemesis' the same guy in 'Sugar'?

    http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=X2u4eyiEqEE&feature=related

    link to 'everyone...'
  19. avatar Cake
    No, I don't think it is, although it is possible. Same production company for both videos. Guy in Nemesis owned the building in which it was filmed, guy in Sugar is a professional actor, although I suppose it's possible for a professional actor to own a building.
  20. avatar goatboy
    Number 1 in the Myspace chart.

    Very well done indeed.
  21. avatar Siouxsie Tremolo
    Sorry buddy but they're not quite there on the myspace chart yet, though you CAN all go here [url]http://www.mtv.co.uk/myspacechart[/url] to make it so!
  22. avatar goatboy
    [quote:61372bcad3="Siouxsie Tremolo"]Sorry buddy but they're not quite there on the myspace chart yet, though you CAN all go here [url]http://www.mtv.co.uk/myspacechart[/url] to make it so![/quote]

    Well, buddy.........

    I watched the chart this evening (MTV2 8-9pm, channel 355 on Sky Digital) with my own two fucking eyes and there it was..... number 1.
  23. avatar Pavel
    [quote:1243db0396="Cake"]The video wasn't as expensive to make as you might think...[/quote:1243db0396]

    I don't personally think it was 'that' expensive, but I'm sure it was more than what bands over here usually play with.

    It was shot on the RedOne (not sure which version but I would imagine it wasn't a Scarlett, and the production company probably own it so...a Zero perhaps) / and most of the post production was done by Ben himself to my knowledge.

    More input directly by Ben means less outsourcing, even within house - so I'd say...£6/800 or so?
  24. avatar Freex
    I liked the whole Sin City vibe not too sure what it was about but liked the tune, liked the vid, unlike some others which had an interesting vid but shit song so the vid got stopped mid play.

    A good song doesn't need much, a bad song may need more to grab you but unless it really catches your interest it's a waste of time.

    [u:ed7887dbfa]NIChart[/u:ed7887dbfa]
    I'd liked the oppenhimer one with the photos, but I don't remember the song. Was too busy watching the photos to pay any attention to the song. Not sure how it would play again.

    Most of the other just didn't grab me either way.

    I think a video can help a song make more sense, or expand it narratively. Or it can just entertain. But it should have a purpose.
    A band strumming away solely, just does nothing for me personally.
  25. avatar Cake
    [quote:6c4ccc9501="Freex"]

    [u:6c4ccc9501]NIChart[/u:6c4ccc9501]
    I'd liked the oppenhimer one with the photos, but I don't remember the song. Was too busy watching the photos to pay any attention to the song. Not sure how it would play again.

    [/quote:6c4ccc9501]

    Breakfast In NYC. Great song, Great video.
  26. avatar Di Di Mau
    [quote:ae257529c5]Well, buddy.........

    I watched the chart this evening (MTV2 8-9pm, channel 355 on Sky Digital) with my own two fucking eyes and there it was..... number 1. [/quote:ae257529c5]
    ha ha. not sure why this made me laugh so much...but it was very funny.

    *Sorry sarah
  27. avatar Steven Dedalus
    If you're going to do a video, you might as well do it properly.

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Qsn4KReWxSs
  28. avatar MULLAN Extraordinaire
    Snazzy looking vid from FWW. Like someone said earlier its a bit cheesy but it'll get people's attention. Hope they get er bucked in America.
  29. avatar richpause
    The productions of 'Sugar' and 'Everyone Needs A Nemesis' are of high quality because they were not produced locally but by a london based company and with budgets beyond what any local director could attain.

    to quote "the video may not have been as expensive as you think"... it still was way above what local directors could even dream of. lol more than all the budgets of all local videos put together.

    Its easy to say that we have the talent to do so much better and i agree. As co-founder of chewie films and doing work for fww in the past, everything was made on shoe string budgets but it was the ability to work with no money but with ideas is all we have in northern ireland.

    in terms of ability, you can't equate fww to the local scene now for the simple fact that they have a big label behind them, they DO have money and it IS money that makes the quality of these videos. think of the location hire, the HD cameras, the production crew, the post-production... that ain't no ATL commission for £300. think closer to 5 figures.

    yes local bands deserve better videos but local bands (and labels) do not have the money to pay for better videos and i for one couldnt go on making videos for the love, how can you make a living if someone pays you a couple of hundred for a video which barely covers its cost never mind the time you put into it. i have regularly encountered the thought that everything can be done for the price of tape, but few realise or value the time, effort and skills put into making video work.

    as much as i love making music videos i fast realised it's no career move in belfast.

    also a point was made about getting the video seen. you just can't argue that people don't have high expectations to get their work seen. i have tried submitting various videos to mtv etc and basically if you don't have management or some kind of publicity company behind you you'll find it a waste of time...

    who do we have for support? good question.
    NIScreen don't music videos because of the rights over music and the fact that they don't belong to the director.
    NIMIC (?) there's a question... considering that music videos assist in the overall promotion of local bands you wonder why they aren't big into this area.
    ATL TV provides commissions which is a great opportunity for directors to work with local bands and is how i began working with FWW and as a music video director, but considering its the BBC their budget is tighter than most penniless bands can provide! They also don't allow as much airtime for local videos that they haven't commissioned as they probably should.

    the idea of a collective is interesting but unsure how it could work.

    all money talk aside there are alot of great directors and great ideas bouncing around and yes, alot of potential but until there's more money and more outside support from those who can promote the work...
  30. avatar DuncanDisorderly
    EDIT
    Last edited on , 1 times in total.
  31. avatar richpause
    [quote:967b7eaa8e]ni screen is simply there to facilitate bigger productions coming into the country - i was told this by the head of the foundation himself. they couldn't care less about short films, music videos and up and coming film makers - which is a shame as the creative industries here are stifled unless your involved in something about say 'the troubles'. [/quote:967b7eaa8e]

    sadly true and is a big problem here with film in general. help quickly turned away from assisting local talent to attracting the big money but they still convince themselves they are here for us. it's a struggle alright.

    but hey, just think, when you've finally got somewhere they'll be happy to help you then.

    you're right that a collective would mean a pool of resources aslong as people were genuinely open to it and willing. i guess that happens already though in various ways but not as an established collective.

    must chat to you more about music video work sometime...
  32. avatar tinpot anto
    Just be creative.

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7n5stazpxE

    Cost £12.50

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Ztvb_BErk3w

    Cost £7.00
  33. avatar DuncanDisorderly
    [quote:95d4a2f83e="tinpot anto"]Just be creative.

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7n5stazpxE

    Cost £12.50

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Ztvb_BErk3w

    Cost £7.00[/quote:95d4a2f83e]

    That camera, lighting and editing software must have been a great bargain. People seem to be misunderstanding the TRUE cost to the person making the video. Not all of us have outside sources to fall back on.
  34. avatar Pavel
    [quote:c68dd3aec5="richpause"]sadly true and is a big problem here with film in general. help quickly turned away from assisting local talent to attracting the big money but they still convince themselves they are here for us. it's a struggle alright.

    but hey, just think, when you've finally got somewhere they'll be happy to help you then.

    you're right that a collective would mean a pool of resources aslong as people were genuinely open to it and willing. i guess that happens already though in various ways but not as an established collective.

    must chat to you more about music video work sometime...[/quote:c68dd3aec5]

    I'm going to have a ponder about this idea of a collective - because to be honest, at the present time the only way we're going to get ahead is by helping ourselves.

    Who would be interested in meeting up some day/night for a yarn about it? : matt@pavelware.com
  35. avatar captain a
    that fighting with wire video cost me about 14 euro on saturday night but thats a different story.

    this is how to make a video for free.

    http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=7Z86K6hcBkA&feature=channel_page

    or this

    http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=lCbojvlWN_k
  36. avatar tinpot anto
    Which is The Frames vid, where they used the CCTV from a shop and just filmed Glen singing with a mask on, then gave the shopkeeper a fiver for the tape?
  37. avatar captain a
    i think its called 'once'
  38. avatar tinpot anto
    har har hardy har har :)
  39. avatar Cake
    Smalltown America in 'video that cost less than five figures to make' shocker

    http://www.vimeo.com/3074037
  40. avatar nichart
    i suppose anyone can make a video for next to nothing but making a good video that is going to get seen by the general public is the hard bit... and i guess it's also down to the bands and their management to push videos in press release, websites, and to local media etc.
    i really don't mean to plug again but the main idea behind my website is to have something for bands who release singles... and nothing actually happens. they might have a launch night but that's the height of it. At least if they enter it into the chart they can compare download figures to other acts. .. and i thinking of doing something so this can happen with music videos too, so that at least if they are released somewhere will show them. already have about 20 vids on the site and putting new ones up all the time, so if you want yours up then get in touch.
    Also i have to say that i think Rich's FWW videos are much better than the recent one. they give a feeling of what the band are truly like.
  41. avatar DuncanDisorderly
    anyone interested the idea of a collective make it known and we will see how it pans out!
  42. avatar Pavel
    Tristan, any interest in having a chat about forming a little film making community?

    ...or anyone else for that matter?

    Got a few names already, wouldn't mind seeing some of the ones I know personally getting in touch - don't stand out in the cold fellows.
  43. avatar tinpot anto
    The video for Sitting There will be editted as part of a nice little VT to be broadcast on tonight's Hearts and Minds on BBC2 at 7.30

    It will also feature an interview and a live acoustic version of Rather you than Me.

    Also featured will be Cara Robinson and the Bad Habits.
  44. avatar Rocky
    The Breakfast in NYC video cost about £165 to make.
    Loads of time put into the art on the photos.
    Shot on the second take I believe.

    I like the FWW video.

    In Case Of Fire have had a couple of great looking videos recently too.
  45. avatar The_Martyr
    Breakfast In NYC is one of my favourite videos, it's inspired.
  46. avatar nichart
    [quote:b627000464] Pavel
    05 Feb 2009 00:37
    Tristan, any interest in having a chat about forming a little film making community?[/quote:b627000464]

    aye matthew, give us a shout if you get a few people.think you have my email.[/quote]
  47. avatar nichart
    [quote:0f902abd66] Pavel
    05 Feb 2009 00:37
    Tristan, any interest in having a chat about forming a little film making community?[/quote:0f902abd66]

    aye matthew, give us a shout if you get a few people.think you have my email.[/quote]
  48. avatar basik
    My first post!
    Hey everybody,

    Iím Ben and I directed the Nemesis & Sugar videos for FWW. Reading this thread has been really interesting for me as the feedback I usually get is never this honest... I really appreciate all the comments made about the videos - both positive and negative - but their seems to be a few misconceptions that I would like to clear up. I hope you donít mind.

    I have a production company called Basik Products (www.basikproducts.com). Basik isnít a huge London based corporate media machine as some of you may think - itís a me in a studio in Brighton. I have worked in the industry for years and use Basik as a creative Ďumbrellaí for whatever I produce and a way of marketing myself and the people I work with.

    The FWW videos were not tendered out and we didnít win any pitch. It was a far more personal approach. I first met Cahir while I was making a documentary about Seafood in 2007, we spent 11 days in a van together where we became firm friends. I have directed 4 Seafood videos which Cahir knew about and liked and the subject of me directing FWW videos came up. This was way before they signed to a major label and so budget was simply out of the question but I agreed to put something together for them to help them out anyway.

    We actually wrote a treatment, composed storyboards and even got as far as doing tests but then all went quiet. I didnít hear much from Cahir after that and assumed he wasnít interested anymore but actually, unbeknownst to me, the band were working on getting signed to a major label. In early 2008 Cahir phoned me and pretty much told me I was doing there video for Nemesis and that they had a budget. I was very honored.

    There is a lot of talk about the budgets for the videos on this thread so to clear things up this is the breakdown: I had a budget of £10,000 to make 2 videos. The first ĎNemesisí had to be a pretty straight up performance video to showcase the band (as stipulated by the labels). £3500 was spent on the production. The second ĎSugarí I had a little more free reign to do something more creative - and to reflect that - the balance of £6500 was spent in producing this video.

    Just for the record - I personally never made any money from either videos, every last penny went into making the videos as good as they can be. So if anyone has the misconception of me driving around in a Porsche - please think again. I am far from money driven.

    Itís true, the budgets for both videos were considerably higher than most directors get given, but what youíve got to understand is that with a higher budget comes huge expectation and certain limitations.

    You canít take the money and make what you want to make, every part of the process is analyzed and Ďsigned offí by the record companies and band. Instantly this takes a lot of the more experimental and risky ideas out of the equation because if there is just one person that doesnít understand the concept - itís back to the drawing board. Along with this you have to think about the broadcasting boundaries - having worked at MTV for over 10 years - I know these all to well and believe me they really do affect the way your concepts form.

    Also being given a bigger budget means more pressure to deliver exactly what has been agreed in the treatment / storyboard stage. To be able to guarantee delivery it is wise to hire professionals, and as you all know, professionals cost money. As soon as professionals are in the mix the whole process becomes more costly and the Ďbig budgetí soon dwindles away and you find yourself even more constrained than a low budget video.

    For example; for both FWW videos I had to come up with concepts that could be shot in a day as the budget would not allow otherwise. With such a tight time frame production needs to run smoothly so shooting anything outside or in a changeable environment is risky which is why both videos are shot in a controlled environment. As you can imagine, this limits your creativity a bit. Iím not saying that a location shoot couldnít have been done but it poses all sorts of logistical issues and the bottom line is that I didnít want to let the band down.

    Some of you have said the Sugar video is cheesy... well Iím not sure cheesy is the word but it is quite obvious. This is a classic example of how the Ďprocessí affects the final product. Initially it was supposed to be a very dark video that was based around a personal issue that Cahir was going through and there wasnít supposed to be much performance featured at all. Then the collective decision was made to dilute the narrative to take the spotlight off Cahir a bit. Thatís why the other two sets of characters were introduced, the first being a sweet and innocent Ďteenageí couple and the other being a more mature, scorned and complicated couple.

    In the first cut the narrative worked really well as by the end you began to understand each Ďcouplesí predicaments but both the record company and the band wanted more performance in there. Unfortunately the narrative had to give way to the performance which is why the final version a bit confusing. At the end of the day itís not my money and if the band and the record label are happy - Iím happy.

    I liked the Nemesis video more because of the weird process we went through to get there. The original treatment was for a big posh looking Foo Fighters performance video in a white warehouse, but after I booked the location I had a phone call 2 weeks later saying that the warehouse had been torn down 6 months prior. This phone call was made 2 days before the shoot and everything was booked which meant cancellation charges if I pulled the shoot... the company I booked the location with were not exactly helpful and the only other location on their books was £7000 per day. Anyway, I got in contact with Lord Davenport directly. Lord Davenport is the owner of the location you see in Nemesis and is quite a bizarre guy. He said that if I put him in the video he would only charge me £500. I wasnít sure but said yes out of desperation. Hereís the twist though, the DOP on Nemesis is also the DOP on Dragons Den and I got to thinking that this was an opportunity I couldnít miss, so thatís why the video turned out like a weird showcase for this Lord.

    My heart is very much in this video as my Grandmother, that I was really close to, died during the post production and making this video helped me through the grief.

    Before I even thought about concepts for the videos I made - I researched the bands previous videos that Chewie Films had produced and I was blown away with what I saw - especially Long Distance. These videos inspired me to follow on from what Chewie Films had started. Maybe the bigger budgets should have been offered to these guys first as they put the leg work in but for some reason they didnít and the one comment that saddens me is from one of the Co-Founders of Chewie in which he states that the only reason Nemesis & Sugar look good is because of the money behind them. Of course everyone is entitled to his opinion but the fact is that money doesnít make a video look good. I love FWW - the band and their music and that is what makes these videos the way they are.

    Thanks for reading.

    Ben

    P.S. If there are any Seafood fans out there - I have just finished a 75 min tour documentary about them (with absolutely no budget at all) and Iím happy to send out copies... Please send me a stamped & addressed padded envelope to Basik Products, 11 Vine Street, Brighton, East Sussex, BN1 4AG.
  49. avatar DuncanDisorderly
    an interesting read it has to be said. what are these 'boundaries' you mentioned in regard to being shown on tv?

    the video looks great and fitted in well every time ive seen it on tv. regardless of budget a crap video is a crap video. oh and cloaking is still an awesome song!
  50. avatar critic_al
    not a fww fan but i like this video.
  51. avatar captain a
    thats very interesting to hear the story and background of the making of. it could be taken either as postive or negative, but i thought this sounded a lot like foo fighters and looked a lot like qotsa.
  52. avatar basik
    [quote:78898288a2="Cake"]No, I don't think it is, although it is possible. Same production company for both videos. Guy in Nemesis owned the building in which it was filmed, guy in Sugar is a professional actor, although I suppose it's possible for a professional actor to own a building.[/quote:78898288a2]

    The guy in Nemesis is Lord Davenport who owned the location and the guy in Sugar is a friend of mine James Hillier who is a regular in Holby Blue and has appeared in Eastenders. Really good actor.
  53. avatar basik
    [quote:14304830d8="DuncanDisorderly"]an interesting read it has to be said. what are these 'boundaries' you mentioned in regard to being shown on tv?

    the video looks great and fitted in well every time ive seen it on tv. regardless of budget a crap video is a crap video. oh and cloaking is still an awesome song![/quote:14304830d8]

    Wow, where do I start... the boundaries are huge. The thing about music videos, especially for bigger record labels, is that you have to tailor them to an international market for syndication to various territories. So any cultural reference points have to be very generic and anything offensive or adult themed will be automatically rejected.

    Strobing, any flashing lights of any kind will be given in the Harding test, which if failed, the video is not fit for broadcast because it has the potential to send epileptics in to a fit. More than 3 flashes over 70% in lumanence and your video fails.

    Undue prominence, no labels no cars no nothing that can be related to a product. Hip Hop video directors have a nightmare with this one.

    There are a few other issues to look out for but the main thing is to make it good / interesting enough to get it past the various departments that acquire the videos for different channels while maintaining an understanding of the wide audience that may watch the video.

    If you really want to get into the nitty gritty of it all - have a look at the Offcom regulations. Nightmare.

    Thanks, I really like Cloaking too... although the band and label didn't at the time!
  54. avatar basik
    [quote:2b867700a4="captain a"]thats very interesting to hear the story and background of the making of. it could be taken either as postive or negative, but i thought this sounded a lot like foo fighters and looked a lot like qotsa.[/quote:2b867700a4]

    Oh man... bingo. I love FWW because they wear their influences on their sleeve and that's the Foo sound and my favorite ever video is QOTSA 'Go With The Flow'. Positive Positive Positive.
  55. avatar Pavel
    Thanks for the breakdown Ben, it's really appreciated.
  56. avatar basik
    [quote:0c1486c6a5="Pavel"]Thanks for the breakdown Ben, it's really appreciated.[/quote:0c1486c6a5]

    Your welcome... To be honest I was flattered to even find a discussion related to the videos!
  57. avatar richpause
    hi ben, thanks for your response. i found it interesting and honest. but i couldnt help but feel the dig of the following comment:


    [quote:ae1b92ac8c]the one comment that saddens me is from one of the Co-Founders of Chewie in which he states that the only reason Nemesis & Sugar look good is because of the money behind them. Of course everyone is entitled to his opinion but the fact is that money doesnít make a video look good.[/quote:ae1b92ac8c]

    reading this made me feel like i must have sounded spiteful...which i am not and hope i didn't come across that way. i wasn't having a jab at your videos. i think they look great.
    i feel like my words might have been misunderstood. ?

    i was arguing the point that money = access to good equipment/cameras/location etc which produces the quality videos that we recognise on, say, MTV. I was talking purely on a production level.

    I was mentioning nothing about ideas and content. was that what you were referring to when you said "money doesn't make a video look good"...?

    if we start talking about ideas and content then i agree that money isn't needed to make good videos.
    (i hope this makes sense)
  58. avatar basik
    Hi Rich,

    Yeah, I think I misunderstood... I was trying to fix my dishwasher at the same time as reading the thread and maybe I didn't quite get on your wavelength.

    You know how it is with this kind of thing - if you do something creative you lay yourself out for criticism - which is fine. If someone likes it or not after I've made it doesn't really matter to me as long as it provokes some kind of reaction. But if anyone questions the integrity in the way in which it was done... that annoys me and I guess I'm a little sensitive to that. Sorry.

    Hope all is going well at Chewie Towers.

    Ben
  59. avatar DuncanDisorderly
    If I understand it correctly I think he meant that its impossible to do what you did (which is excellent, no one is arguing that) on the budgets that most of us are on - despite a comparatively low budget the video still cost much more than most of us have to go on.

    He wasn't talking down your work or so I assume - it was more in defense of people going 'all videos with local bands should be this good' - production value is always a big factor despite what anyone says. Ingenuity can help but it cant solve everything.
  60. avatar basik
    [quote:83d8c17a44="DuncanDisorderly"]If I understand it correctly I think he meant that its impossible to do what you did (which is excellent, no one is arguing that) on the budgets that most of us are on - despite a comparatively low budget the video still cost much more than most of us have to go on.

    He wasn't talking down your work or so I assume - it was more in defense of people going 'all videos with local bands should be this good' - production value is always a big factor despite what anyone says. Ingenuity can help but it cant solve everything.[/quote:83d8c17a44]

    I completely agree... money does of course give you the luxury of better cameras, secured locations, trained professionals etc that will make the final product look better. But look at it this way - with a low budget production there are so many hurdles to overcome which invariably you have to do yourself. An old school director on a big production would ask his 1st assistant director to get something do who would then ask the 2nd assistant director would would ask the runner... where is the satisfaction in that? The role of 'director' has evolved so much in the last 10 years because of technological advancement. This is both a good and bad thing as I feel that the eye gets taken off the ball sometimes. Remember - a director is there to fulfill his vision and this sometimes gets a bit diluted by having to worry about lighting, focus, etc...

    I'm not trying to engineer compliments for myself here, I posted my initial comment to try and break down the 'smoke and mirrors' of the production behind the 2 videos I did to let you guys know that a good video is attainable on a fraction of the budget. Also that 'having' money is not always what it is cracked up to be.

    I haven't always had the luxury of budgets like I had for FWW. Check this video I did for Seafood for £300.
    http://www.basikproducts.com/product/?video=seafoodsignal
    This is by far the best video I've done in my book and that is because of the freedom the low budget gave me.

    So, as much as a low budget is frustrating, in some ways it's quite liberating... It seems to me that there is a great scene in NI both musically and in production. Having been exposed to both sides of the coin I know that certain people in the industry get nervous of people that make low budget films and music videos because it makes their clients question why they should spend so much on a production in the first place.

    People like you guys are what keeps the industry on its toes - so keep going.
  61. avatar basik
    Oh man, I sound like a sexist pig... a director fulfilling 'his' vision? I trained under 2 brilliant female directors at MTV so I have no idea why I said that... sorry ladies!
  62. avatar fopp
    Here, what news of seafood? I haven't heard anything for ages and am a little worried...
  63. avatar basik
    [quote:f468795992="fopp"]Here, what news of seafood? I haven't heard anything for ages and am a little worried...[/quote:f468795992]

    It's officially over for Seafood. Dave has 2 kids and manages a pub full time. Caz has a baby boy called Duke. Kev Penney is a foley editor in the world of film. Cahir is too busy with FWW. So the film is kind of a tribute to Seafood.
  64. avatar fopp
    Aw, my worst fears and all that. I suppose I'm not entirely surprised but it is really disappointing. Nothing's ever been posted on their web pages though about splitting up, one of the last posts from the myspace page was about wanting to create a really great and important next album. Alas. As humble as my opinion is, their last album was probably by far their best.
  65. avatar theavenue
    Not a fan of of the music, however well done on the music video. Looked slick, and I'm a sucker for the sin city look. (Although The Spirit wasn't great)

    I feel sad for the poor bass player and his instantly noticeable receding hair line.
  66. avatar Pavel
    ...so that's why Jamie shaves his head?
  67. avatar basik
    Haha, Jamie pretty much admitted as much when I saw him last week! Shouldn't laugh, it will happen to us all one day...
    Anyway, have a look at these:
    http://www.basikproducts.com/product/?video=seafoodpt1
    http://www.basikproducts.com/product/?video=seafoodpt2
    Taken from the Seafood film I've just made, Cahir is in fine form. Just uploading a 3rd part now.
  68. avatar Pavel
    I've always wondered because every photo I have of Jamie, he's clean cut to the scalp and every video/photo I see that other people have taken he's suddenly sprouted three feet of hair.

    :D.