1. avatar KingNeon
    [quote:fc252cdc98]A cost-cutting proposal by Northern Ireland Railways could mean the end of train services on Sundays, the BBC understands.[/quote:fc252cdc98]

    [url]http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/7694363.stm[/url]

    I thought I could at the very least expect my already ludicrously high fares to deliver a half decent service. How wrong I am!
  2. avatar Deestroyer
    We'll be bartering with chickens next. Would someone with an ounce of sense please launch a coup on these tubes we presently call politicians. Fastfuders to the fore of the vanguard please...
  3. avatar T Entertainment
    Sure, why deal with piffling details like transport when there's the prospect of a serious digging match on the horizon?

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/7693669.stm
  4. avatar DontPetABurningDog
    And here was me thinking Robinson was all for free assembly, rights to march/protest &c.

    Imagine my surprise when it turns out he's a massive dogwanking hypocrite.
  5. avatar tinpot anto
    I demand that the Black Mountain now states.
    [b:55db472cb5]
    Peter Robinson Wanks Dogs[/b:55db472cb5]

    I like it when politicians warn of trouble, when they actually say "get the petrol bombs ready boys we're having a riot!"

    SF are killing themselves on this. They have no basis to organise this protest. Relatives for Justice have organised their own protest with Eirigi, and have disavowed the SF rally so that's the victims of the British Army card gone, what's more Gerry A and Martin were over shaking hands with GWB 2 weeks after the war in Iraq started, so where's the platform for opposing the war? Not to mention undermining the status of the Parades Commision with spurious applications and using Paul Maskey as the spokesman for this when he can hardly speak.

    Spoons the whole lot of them. A major major own goal.
  6. avatar DontPetABurningDog
    Shinners in playing for appearances shocker!

    The whole thing's a bag of slightly warmed up cat sick. Neither party, so far as I can tell, honestly, truly gives a fuck, but this is a nice way of keeping the sheep motivated. You, there, Shake your fist at them Taigs! You, there, you shake the fist at them huns! Ignore us as we sly-fuck you out of something else in the background, just get to your little parades and wave your placard like an arse. Bread and circuses.
  7. avatar T Entertainment
    I can only assume they think this is going to be cancelled or moved to another location. Even if it doesn't kick off, I really fail to see the strategic advantage of putting everyone at each other's throats like this.
    The Andytown News had a very reasonable editorial, pointing out that republican events / protests in the city centre have gone unmolested for a number of years now, which certainly wasn't always the case. And might not be again after this.
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  8. avatar trepanner
    [quote:3528a40d21="tinpot anto"]
    Peter Robinson Wanks Dogs[/b]
    [/quote:3528a40d21]

    "Iris honey, at least I'm not gay"
  9. avatar tinpot anto
    But it's a total own goal in all those respects. Sinn Fein have conclusively failed to make a convincing case that the march is necessary or desireable in any respect, and the growing threat that it will be a violent flashpoint, mean that the only people who are likely to attend the rally are sectarian thugs looking for a recreational riot. They seem to be hell bent on completely alienating the educated professional demographic that forms the main block of their current electoral support for the sake of a last yahoo to the olden days.

    Bonkers.
  10. avatar rentaghost
    yesbut at least the hiring of multiple buses to bring protesters from all ends of the country to this event can show once and for all the desire, nay, the[i:a4be59f3cb] need[/i:a4be59f3cb] to have better provision of public transport on a Sunday.
  11. avatar DontPetABurningDog
    Does either "side" in this pitiful little debacle (to be clear, i'm no great fan of either side here. The Military homecoming seems to me to be a News Letter derived arsearound, and the Counter-protest a slabbering match rising to it) realise that if they keep things dignified and peaceful, they're on instant moral high ground? Does common sense like that, and, y'know, generally not being a bunch of complete wankers ever enter their minds?
  12. avatar DontPetABurningDog
    Fair point, Anto. I suppose my only explanation is that this might be the Shinners letting the discontented know they don't need to go over to that nasty Ruari Ó Bradaigh, and that the good folks at the Provisional Wing still have their Brit Hatiing needs covered. They could be playing the angle that their educated, professional demographic really has nowhere to go to, since abandoning SDLP en masse. Voting for SF could have become a self-perpetuating state of affairs. (Caution: Contains Facile Political Analysis. If you think any of this is correct, check first. I'm flying by me arsecheeks here)
  13. avatar T Entertainment
    If things go as they currently stand, I'd be surprised if there wasn't trouble at interfaces from people heading back from the parade/protests. At the least.
  14. avatar POSITIVExYOUTH
    This will teach them Translink wanks not to invest in electric train like the rest of the frigging civilized world. Come on, even in my own Italy that has a train system that can only be compared to the one in India or Pakistan we have an electric rail system.

    And I assumed we all knew that politicians are a bunch hypocrite dogwank.
  15. avatar tinpot anto
    It's an almost certainty. "Community Representatives" have saturated the Shankill with yellow ribbons and "Support our Troops" posters, along with reports of rather more explicit round-robin texts - it's clear someone wants Nov 2nd used as a line-in-the-sand.

    it makes no sense for SF to attempt to appease the dissident lobby, who all left a long time ago and will have no truck with Shinners at all. It seems to be an internal faction who are missing the grassroots influence as community organisers and want to flex those muscles again. It's utterly cynical and utterly doomed to failure the inevitable trouble will have the effect of decimating them at the polls. the SDLP may not be an option for most but I'd see the Greens and the SWP's making a bizarre jump at the next round.


    I'd say trouble will flair up from Halloween night onwards through the weekend.
  16. avatar T Entertainment
    I gather little else has been talked about on the Shankill, Shore Road and Newtownards Road since the counter protest was announced.
  17. avatar DontPetABurningDog
    I think we more or less agree here, but are talking slightly at cross purposes. I'm not sure I agree that trouble will decimate them at the polls though. Sinn Féin have a peculiar knack of being able to light a fire, and watch it burn, matches and petrol in hand, and deny all responsibility for the damage caused. It nearly hurts me to say it, but the cynical buggers are damned good at this sort of thing, and they generally don't do anything without having all the angles worked out. As it goes, all they need to do is make sure not to cast the first stone. Provoking nastiness from Loyalism that looks well on the news isn't exactly difficult, and, as ever, it would appear that the Shinners can play them like a piano.
  18. avatar tinpot anto
    Not this time. Normally such a thing runs as smooth as polished steel, the lines are drawn up far in advance and the moderates are brought along with the tide.

    This seems like they've completely misjudged the mood, and are persisting in insulting the intelligence of their electorate. Maskey as a spokesman has made most people cringe with embarrassment

    The SF protest will likely consist of an embarrassingly poor turnout, mostly consisting of SF members, kids looking a riot and dissidents out to ruin the Shinner's name. Violence is depressingly inevitable, and would be completely avoidable and unjustified in the eyes of their voters.

    Unless the PSNI open fire with plastic bullets and wound a few kids there is really no way that SF can come out of this in profit.

    I mean even if everything goes "to plan" and there is no violence, SF will still be left with a pathetic turnout at a protest that makes them look foolish and out-of-touch. The news will be full of 17 yr old boys looking dapper in their dress uniforms amidst talk of their brave sacrifice and crying proud parents and relatives.
    Last edited on , 2 times in total.
  19. avatar DontPetABurningDog
    Unless, of course, their very presence goads the wombles into first strike mode, which is not beyond the realms of possibilty. Blood Sacrifice, so to speak?
  20. avatar JTM
    At the risk of getting back on topic, how many people actually use the trains after 10pm or on a Sunday? Sunday? Yes, I've seen them. After 10pm? Only on weekends. I'd rather lose later services than Sunday services personally. Although losing any of them sucks.
  21. avatar DontPetABurningDog
    Y'see, now, if I was translink, I'd be playing it awful fuckin' quiet regarding money. They weren't shy to bump their fares when the ould diesel went up a bit, and seem in no particular hurry to put them back down again. I suppose you can do that when you've got a monopoly, and the customer can just bend over and take whatever's coming.
  22. avatar tinpot anto
    I use sunday service all the time. The late night service would be more useful if it was actually a bit later and you could use it to get home after a proper night out, and not cut it short.

    Back to the other thing...

    The only way out is for SF to call of their parade in the next few days when the other side have been pepped up to the nines with the promise of being let off the leash, and are beyond the point of no return, and stand back and watch.

    God forbid that was their actual strategy in this.
  23. avatar trepanner
    I find the Enterprise is an unbeatable way to spend a long afternoon stationery on the line a few miles outside of Drogheda.
  24. avatar T Entertainment
    Until this week I assumed SF would call it off, but no longer looks like it...there was another press conference this morning with not a hint of it. And a call for the homecoming parade to be moved to the Odyssey?!
    What IS the issue here?
  25. avatar tinpot anto
    Families who have lost members to British Forces and have yet to recieve justice have the right to protest peacefully at the glorification of the British Army. People may not agree with this, but it is at least a logical and understandable position.


    Likewise other groups have a right to protest at the continued involvement of the British Army in the occupation of Iraq and Afganistan.

    Sinn Fein has no platform from which to speak for either of these lobbies, or organise a protest in their name, given their complicity with the Bush administration, and their acceptance of a baseline (normalised) level of British Army presence during the last round of talks.

    Especially given that groups representing both interests have organised their own protests independently of SF.
  26. avatar Recycled Alien
    [quote:06fcbdc075="POSITIVExYOUTH"]This will teach them Translink wanks not to invest in electric train like the rest of the frigging civilized world. Come on, even in my own Italy that has a train system that can only be compared to the one in India or Pakistan we have an electric rail system.
    [/quote:06fcbdc075]The Italian rail system is superb. Cheap, clean, fast, efficient and punctual.

    Among other routes around central Italy, I've used the Bologna - Florence service several times. The distance is roughly equivalent to Belfast - Dublin, but it's far quicker and costs €5.10

    I've always said that the Translink management should all be sacked and replaced by the people who organise the Hilden Festival. Because they [b:06fcbdc075]can[/b:06fcbdc075] actually organise a piss-up in a brewery.
  27. avatar flackmeister
    [quote:bc24ba02da="DontPetABurningDog"] I suppose you can do that when you've got a monopoly, and the customer can just bend over and take whatever's coming.[/quote:bc24ba02da]

    Brilliant.

    That just about sums up the entire discussion.

    :lol:
  28. avatar flackmeister
    [quote:3ba8cba268="Recycled Alien"]I've always said that the Translink management should all be sacked and replaced by the people who organise the Hilden Festival. Because they [b:3ba8cba268]can[/b:3ba8cba268] actually organise a piss-up in a brewery.[/quote:3ba8cba268]

    Ah jebus, I've just read down and spotted this.

    Its great how we all love Transhite isn't it?

    Nice one.
  29. avatar tinpot anto
    I liked it when the bus timetables used to list the head of the complaints department as "P. O'Neill"

    I never complained.
  30. avatar fastfude
    If Translink is a private company, howcome there's no market competition?
  31. avatar rentaghost
    [quote:a109a6162b="tinpot anto"]I liked it when the bus timetables used to list the head of the complaints department as "P. O'Neill"

    [/quote:a109a6162b]

    Philip is a lovely bloke. He was on my Masters degree course.
  32. avatar tinpot anto
    Ask NIE
  33. avatar rentaghost
    [quote:6ddd2e0498="fastfude"]If Translink is a private company, howcome there's no market competition?[/quote:6ddd2e0498]

    Stagecoach looked at coming over here for a while, but there aren't enough people to make it worth their while.

    There is some market competition in rural areas with the provision of rural community transport, but in urban areas we are stuck with Translink. Same issue as having a sole electricity provider, gas provider etc.

    If the government didnt subsidise these provisions, we wouldnt have anything even vaguely resembling a service, unless we cooperated with the providers in the south more - which is hte case of electricity, is already being mooted.

    The consumer council recently did a study on these very issues, but i dont think the results are out yet.
  34. avatar Lap Dog Shuffle
    Maybe if they provided a decent service on Sundays more people would use it. Translink's Sunday services to Lisburn consist of one train an hour (on the half hour) and a Bus more or less on the hour (which arrives at more or less the same time as the train!) I'd much rather both these proposals would go through if the alternative was a decent night bus/Sunday bus service (one that doesn't add half an hour to the journey by traversing the lower falls).

    [img:c6832fcd22]http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/45038000/jpg/_45038485_ead238a8-fabf-446a-877d-85b883fbe84d.jpg[/img:c6832fcd22]
    Is it totally sad that I know that this dude hasn't worked for Translink for several years?
  35. avatar blonderedhead
    Well they had to let Sting go to save money, his wages were very demanding
  36. avatar KingNeon
    I remember your man too, he was one of the few decent members of staff at Great Victoria Street, the majority of whom I found rude and ignorant. There seems to be a lot of new staff brought in recently, they seem to be a bit more professional than previous ones.
  37. avatar Lap Dog Shuffle
    [quote:0a67c44584="KingNeon"]I remember your man too, he was one of the few decent members of staff at Great Victoria Street, the majority of whom I found rude and ignorant. There seems to be a lot of new staff brought in recently, they seem to be a bit more professional than previous ones.[/quote:0a67c44584]

    Aye, he drives a cab now. The older guy in Great Victoria is great too. The young uns have caused me to miss my train a couple of times because they're too busy nattering to sell me a ticket. Hardly the bane of an otherwise metropolitan existence but I make sure they feel the wrath of my "time is money" face. :lol:
  38. avatar Dirty Stevie Grizz
    I barely use translink, but I near shat myself when I was asked for £1.50 to get from the four winds to the city centre. And it took what felt like 3 hours to get into town.

    ON the other thing, I was shown one of the round robin texts, to which Anto alluded earlier, on saturday night and I shuddered. I can't remember the exact detail, but it contained a lot of worthy talk about Our Boys and ended with "Forward this to 5 Protestant friends blah blah" (cos it's that clear cut leeek).
  39. avatar T Entertainment
    If the parade or protest hasn't been cancelled / moved / postponed by Saturday evening, pre-rumble drinking on an eleventh night scale will commence.
  40. avatar POSITIVExYOUTH
    Well, to make things bad, Translink is not technically a private company. Indeed the Northern Ireland Transport Holding Company that runs NI Railway, Ulsterbus and Metro is a company owned by the government and run or at least partially under the management (not too sure about this though) by the Road Service.
    And this makes things worse as you would expect a publicly owned company to make at least a half-decent attempt to have a good reliable service.
  41. avatar my-angel-rocks
    [quote:4a770a817e="translink.co.uk"]The principal objective [in the creation of Translink] was to promote the transfer from private car to public transport on a sustainable basis[/quote:4a770a817e]
  42. avatar The enfant terrible
    Yeah I despair at this backward wee shithole of a province sometime. As for the march and protest I hope it turns violent but not in a hurt people way, more in a vandalism abounds way. Hooray!!
  43. avatar Elms
    [quote:7dbd6255f9]Stagecoach looked at coming over here for a while, but there aren't enough people to make it worth their while.

    There is some market competition in rural areas with the provision of rural community transport, but in urban areas we are stuck with Translink. Same issue as having a sole electricity provider, gas provider etc.

    If the government didnt subsidise these provisions, we wouldnt have anything even vaguely resembling a service, unless we cooperated with the providers in the south more - which is hte case of electricity, is already being mooted.

    The consumer council recently did a study on these very issues, but i dont think the results are out yet. "[/quote:7dbd6255f9]

    Rural community transport is designed to supplement Translink services in rural areas where there isn't the demand to put on a Translink service rather than compete against it, and generally it is only available for more vulnerable or socially excluded members of society such as disabled people or the elderly. Pretty much none of the town or rural bus services that Translink operate come anywhere close to breaking even as there simply isn't the demand to cover costs.

    In urban areas the equivalent is Door-2-Door transport but again it's meant to provide accessible transport for disabled people who can't access Translink services rather than compete against them.

    The government subside Translink to well over £150m a year, and to run at break even point without any government backing fares would have to at least double. NI Railways simply couldn't operate at all without the huge government subsidy it receives as the cost of maintaining the infrastructure just can't be covered by the passenger numbers there are in NI at the current fare levels.

    Co-operating with the south more wouldn't make much of a difference to be honest as all their services run at a similar level of subsidy, and now that Dublin bus is losing a lot of the fuel duty rebate it received it's looking to put fares up in the region of 25-30%.

    The only real competition in bus services locally is the Aircoach to Dublin . In 2003 Trabslink run 8 buses to Dublin, then Aircoach came along in 2004 running 15 services a day. Now Translink operate a bus on the hour, 24 hours a day in addition to the 15 services that Aircoach run (totalling 39 services a day compared to 8 in 2003), and fares are generally lower than they were before Aircoach came along.

    There is an ongoing attempt to reform public transport to introduce a bit more controlled competition (and hence generate efficiency savings for public money and better services) but as you can imagine there are certain parties involved in the provision of public transport provision who are a tad against that. The legislation that covers the licensing of public transport dates back to 1967 so its completely out of date as well.
  44. avatar 10rapid
    sure it's against the law of leviticaus to travel on the sabbath anyhow. peter and iris would be best remembering that
  45. avatar xfirefishx
    What really annoys me is that apparently Ulsterbus and Bus Eireann can't come to an agreement on a student fare for the crossborder bus service when what they actually mean is, we run this bus almost to capacity on most services anyway so why bother running a concession?

    Also, losing Sunday services would be pretty bad - lots of people heading back to Belfast or Derry for example for another week of work or else college etc. As for late night, I've never had any cause to take a train later than 9pm but I suppose for the Bangor, Lisburn lines it might be useful.
  46. avatar goodonpaper
    RE: Translink, best to collate these thoughts?

    http://getsatisfaction.com/translink
  47. avatar tenrabbits
    I have to admit, I've never had particular issue with translink, but I've been living in london the last while, so no doubt when I get back I (like londoners appear to be) will be mighty pissed off if I have to wait more than 4 minutes for a train/bus.
  48. avatar POSITIVExYOUTH
    Besides that, London might be expensive as hell (over £2.50 for a standard Underground ticket?!?) but it's nearly always on time, the busses and tube carriages are clean, there is a very good network (even though I always managed to get lost in parts of London that didn't seem to have bus stops) and the whole price thing is resolved with the Oyster Card so all in all London is what Translink should with to emulate (especially since there have been/are trials for hybrid busses in London with the view of introducing an entire fleet of them).

    But no, it's Northern Ireland and our politicians seem to want to keep the idea that people have abroad that it's a place inhabited by culchies and simpletons that have no clue of how the real world works, besides being generally backward.
  49. avatar tenrabbits
    Aye but it's economies of scale innit - the reason they can run 20 trains an hour on the tube, with the last few having probably 20 people on them, is cos the rush hour is so busy you try to wedge yourself in, or just wait til there's a tiny gap in the carriage to get on - friends that go to manchester at rush hour frequently have to stand the whole way!

    Translink have the problem that the amount of people that use the service (cos lets face it.. most everyone drives in NI - most of my london mates don't even have a driving licence) doesn't enable them to provide the equivalent to anything like london.

    As I said, I have no probs with them generally, and they do manage a service to most parts of our sparsely populated province at least a few times a day.
  50. avatar flackmeister
    [quote:686c8086f7]friends that go to manchester at rush hour frequently have to stand the whole way!
    [/quote:686c8086f7]

    Wait a minute, there's a tube that goes to Manchester???

    :shock:
  51. avatar tenrabbits
    [quote:2fd5617eac="flackmeister"]Wait a minute, there's a tube that goes to Manchester???
    :shock:[/quote:2fd5617eac]

    Aye.. Noel Gallagher, quite regularly.
  52. avatar nonlogic liam
    Translink! Translink! Translink! After all the years of waiting for buses that never come, or are late, or at the very least extremely overpriced I think I have finally cracked. Reason being, one of their flagship "services". The 212 "express" between Belfast and Derry may at first glance seem to be a good service that runs at a reasonable price. But wait! The smartcard system that they use for this service has one horrid, and no doubt well thought out, flaw. It sucks! I encountered this flaw three months ago when I boarded the 212 in Belfast, took out my smartcard (which I assumed still had £25 of my hard earned cash on it) and was told that my card was empty. Shock horror! I missed my bus as I rushed to the ticket office to inquire where my money had gone and the "lady" there said "oh, the five journeys you put on your card have expired". "Expired! I never even used the journeys!" I exclaimed in the face of dismal reality. But low and behold the "lady" was correct. Apparently, the journeys on your "smartcard" run out after three months. This was three months ago and I foolishly topped up a further £25 in order to get on the next bus to Derry. Guess what? I have now given Translink £50 for absolutely nothing. I might as well have run down to the Great Victoria street bus station thrown £50 at the attendant and wept all the way home. Three words come to mind when I think of this blatant rip off: Fu-ck you Translink! Can't anyone do something about this?
  53. avatar The Grace Jones
    While this state of affairs [i:179605eac4]is[/i:179605eac4], certainly, undoubtedly utterly cuntish, you're still a bit of a stupid cunt for not knowing it. I mean, they gave you a leaflet and stuff, ja? Which told you this, ja? That even a half-blind half-mad old shite like me managed to make a shaky-handwriting mental note of, ja? And instead of rolling it up it to smoke white dog poo in or for tickling Chris Lindsay's unmentionables with, you should have just read the facking thing. Come now. Play fair, m'dear.
  54. avatar nonlogic liam
    Yes, but why does it "expire", where does the money go? And no, I wasn't given a leaflet (I hate that word) or informed in anyway about translink's near criminal plan to con the masses. A curse on all their houses...
  55. avatar artofdarkness
    I've moved to a place where there's a limited bus service, and despite the timetable stating there's a direct service through to Belfast, it's a lie that involves you having to board four buses to get there and back, each time telling the driver that the previous one 'said I could get on this bus with this ticket' thereby not giving them the chance to tell me my ticket is invalid.

    I've not gone in for those prepaid cards, I'd rather hold up the queue with cold hard cash. The cards do 'represent a saving' but I don't trust myself when it comes to losing them, whereas I always have a few quid on me.

    I'd write a letter to Translink saying that you were completely unaware of the expiration limit (their communications strategy obviously failed) and such a limit isn't practical for customers such as yourself (you're suggesting an improved customer service via extending it to six months) and could you please have your money back for pointing out this improvement?

    It wouldn't do Translink any harm to extend the time limit, after all, they've already got your money the day you buy it.
  56. avatar tinpot anto
    The leaflet is the eternal servant of the forces of darkness and corruption, from thence will only come pain.

    Likewise "Full terms and conditions are available at www.likefuckyouareevergoingtofindthem.com/hafuckingha/youwanker.htm"
  57. avatar Chi-Lite
    [quote:15c9ba8809="tinpot anto"]Families who have lost members to British Forces and have yet to recieve justice have the right to protest peacefully at the glorification of the British Army. People may not agree with this, but it is at least a logical and understandable position.[/quote:15c9ba8809]

    It also so happens that a substantial amount of those families are affiliated with Sinn Féin though


    [quote:15c9ba8809]Likewise other groups have a right to protest at the continued involvement of the British Army in the occupation of Iraq and Afganistan.[/quote:15c9ba8809]

    Like Sinn Féin

    [quote:15c9ba8809]Sinn Fein has no platform from which to speak for either of these lobbies, or organise a protest in their name, given their complicity with the Bush administration[/quote:15c9ba8809],

    I do kind of accept you point, but "[i:15c9ba8809]complicity[/i:15c9ba8809]"? Like, "[i:15c9ba8809]complicity[/i:15c9ba8809]"???

    As if, like, they've somehow tacitly [i:15c9ba8809]assisted[/i:15c9ba8809] the Bush Administration? As far as I know, Sin Féin has complicitly opposed the Bush Administration, except on those occassions where Sinn Féin want the assistance. What I mean is, Sinn Féin have been helped by the Bush Administration, and have done a bit of bootlicking [i:15c9ba8809]specifically when seeking a certain type of assistance[/i:15c9ba8809]. It's hardly complicity like. It's more like bare-faced cheek, being vociferously opposed, except when they're after something.

    The point is that argument has been made, and a lot of eople accept it. Particularly as Sinn Féin opposition makes no difference whatsoever to the Bush administration, and neither does feigned support. Both Sinn Féin and the Bush administration know this, so it really is bare-faced cheek. Not complicity.

    [quote:15c9ba8809]and their acceptance of a baseline (normalised) level of British Army presence during the last round of talks[/quote:15c9ba8809].

    Ah, so you're now arguing against the underlying assumption of the GFA agreement. All Brits out now Anto, is it?
  58. avatar trepanner
    500 milligrams! He needs it!
  59. avatar tinpot anto
    Marty are you licking bus seats or wha?


    1.
    Relatives For Justice were set up as the campaigning group to demand the truth about deaths caused by the British Army. It was set up with SF support, so that the demands of the families would not be directly linked to electoral politics. They're having their own march/rally. So why are Sinn Fein.

    2.
    Since when was being cheeky an excuse for bare faced cowardly hypocrisy? What the fuck Marty like, seriously come on like? :lol:

    3.
    GFA agreement - you wha? Alex Maskey laying a wreath at the Senotaph? You wha? Wha?





    Wha?

    Ya mad sinn fein ballon ye.
  60. avatar Chi-Lite
    :lol:
    Anto, you're not getting the subtleties of it, in your usual way.

    [quote:b512bfd85a="tinpot anto"]
    Relatives For Justice were set up as the campaigning group to demand the truth about deaths caused by the British Army. It was set up with SF support, so that the demands of the families would not be directly linked to electoral politics. They're having their own march/rally. So why are Sinn Fein.[/quote:b512bfd85a]

    As an argument, this doesn't work. If RFJ was set up in order not to link those deaths with electoral politics (which I'm not sure was the motivation at all), then surely this is precisely one of the occassions when there SHOULD also be a political rally, given that it's a political issue. This isn't a rally about one particular death, it's about a wide issue of militarism and illegal wars.
    Sure by that logic, Sinn Féin have no right to organise rallies about Collusion, which is ballix. You maybe shouldn't be linkngcalls for independent inquiries with politics (maybe...though why shouldn't ya), but this is a wider political issue, why shouldn't there be a political rally?


    [quote:b512bfd85a="tinpot anto"]Since when was being cheeky an excuse for bare faced cowardly hypocrisy?[/quote:b512bfd85a]

    You don't understand....because it's bare-faced cheek, it's not hypocrisy. Hypocrisy is where you pretend to support someone in order to get something off them. Bare-faced cheek is where you don't ever pretend to support them, in fact you attend rallies against them, but will still meet them when you're trying to get something off them. That's just a cheek.


    [quote:b512bfd85a="tinpot anto"]GFA agreement - you wha? Alex Maskey laying a wreath at the Senotaph? You wha? Wha?[/quote:b512bfd85a]

    Aye. Do you think he shouldn't have then? This is the whole point of the GFA you see. "I don't agree with ye, but I'm the mayor and I'll still represent ye as best I can. But I'll do it me own way like, just so's I'm not actually accepting your point of view, I'm just respecting it"...

    I'd imagine was his internal monologue at the time.



    And here, I'm hardly a Sinn Féin balloon, ya rocket. I just dislike shoddy arguments, that's all. :P


    And here, "the Greens and SWP will do well next time"....what fecking planet are you living on. You say it every election too, ya mad bastard. Get the statistics out there to show us how it's possible sure. :lol:
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  61. avatar nonlogic liam
    You gives a f-uck?